WHAT SHOULD BE DONE TO "BAG" THE "SAND"

[barry]

It upset me a little to read that forum about are youths being taught to sandbag. It shouldn't be posted, because if you don't put the idea out there, it probably won't happen. I know some youths in this area and these kids, the Miles boyz, Jake, his sister, and others I know being taught by Jeff Shaw, Jake's parents, Buster Edmonds, Debra Broadie, are all honest, hard working, doing their best to learn and teach. Those kids practice hard on the weekends and these coaches who VOLUNTEER their time work hard with these kids to get good at their sport. Every forum discussion that comes out is about HANDICAP AND SANDBAGGERS. Most times, these cheaters don't win anyway. I just wish we could do away with them and regain the respect of the sport back that these cheaters took away. Isom had a discussion, why get better, Isom we get better cuz that's what you want and I want and a lot of others want. It's the right thing. Is 300....300? Yes it is, and all others above that, who cares, you getz nothing for it. No one cares that you shot 270 with 40 pins and stole a pot that night......CHEATER................. OK, i've vented, so my question is..............WHAT CAN TRULY BE DONE TO LABEL A SANDBAGGING CHEAT and omit them from playing? For years, the things that are done obviously don't work... going back 2-3 years, re-rate, is that the tournament officials don't really apply these rule or is it that this stuff just truly doesn't work. Who has the solution, give it to us please

[F.O.X]

where were they from?

[Chase]

I don't know. But they were bowling very very good...

[F.O.X]

what type of shot per-se' was at the state tournament? a house shot, like what we're "accustomed" to around here?

[Chase]

The shot was easy. DJ shot 730. I shot ok, but could not "carry". I was getting at least 6 "9-counts" every game....mainly 10-pins.

[Martin "BLUFLAME" Seay]

I have been having this thought. why not have all leagues have an easy house shot, then tournaments have a more difficult shot. there for handicap is actually good because you could use it. What's the point of having these different handicaps on the same easy house shots. I throughly enjoy watching 210+ avg bowlers struggle on sport shots. It is a humbling experience. You have to be humbled before you can truly become great.

[Chase]

..so I must be on my way to greatness....LMAO!!!!!

[barry]

Yo flame, I see my discussion is back. I think you should think the other way. Hell, make the league shots tougher then the handicaps would be true and the tourneys would be fair. Think about it, if a person is an ok bowler, and you put them on a tough shot, well they won't have to sandbag, the shot will kick them anyway. I mean look at chase, re rated to 216. Hey, he's getting better, but he just got screwed. Because now he has no pins and most tourneys ask if you've been re rated and to what. Now chase is scratch and can't go back. Why did this happen to chase, because he bowls on ez house shots that give him room for holy error and now when he shoes up in tournaments he has to put numbers up. Hey chase, i'm sure you're reading this, not using u as a goat, but this is the perfect example of what isom said earlier, why improve and have a high avg because my friend, you just got railroaded. you have two ways to go, get alot better and catch up with your new avg or start feeling the handicap pain.

[Chase]

Barry, I agree with you 100%!!!... man you're right. One of the reason's that I started getting better was because I was bowling at Forest Park on Wednesday last year... and the shot was pretty tough. Then, they got new owners...new machines...and an EASY shot. So, instead of me having an improvement at that house from 190 to about 200 or maybe 205, my average there went to 216... and I KNOW I am not at that level yet.

So I say, make the league shots harder or a little more challenging so when any of us go to tournaments we can "show up". Isom did say this earlier...and now I totally understand.

[barry]

Toooo bad, u should have found you a tournament that paid some good money, like 5000 or something, used your cap, got paid and then afterwards getting rerated wouldn't feel so bad. Welcome to our world. It's not that bad Chase, just bowl 850 from now on and you may have a chance to win a tourney sometimes.

[Chase]

Me 850?...lmao. Maybe in no-tap....lol

The day I get "801" I will be the happiest guy in Atlanta. ...like Gomer Pyle..."thank ya, thank ya, thank ya"

[F.O.X]

you just hit the nail on the head. no disrespect to anyone, but this is EXACTLY what is going on around here. the house shots are already TOO easy. you've got people who can barely get to the foul line blowing out racks and in the meantime there are those that CAN get to the foul line and throw a decent shot and getting tapped or wondering what went wrong in their delivery. what's the point in having a high average is somewhat of a true statement. you go into the tournament scratch, you CAN'T AFFORD to throw a bad ball or miss a spare because the guy next to you is getting 30-40 pins and he's shooting 250 with you?! get real....

[Martin "BLUFLAME" Seay]

lol Chase. Maybe the higher avgs. Like its been said before, tough shots dont bring in participation. From what I hear and read, if you think these shots are easy, midwest is too easy. look at the avgs up there. there will never be a way to bag sand besides scratch tournaments. Where there is money someone will find a way to gain an edge. Just make everything scratch and run divisions.

When i first started bowling i was at a crap house and people that would avg 220+ up here were avg 195 there. I think 200 was the house high. barely oiled the lanes and crappy pins. thing is we would hit tournaments with oil, these people shoot lights out. Are they sand bagging, not really. but they get rerated off top.